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jay michael

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Posts posted by jay michael

  2. Ricci's Skram Subwoofer & Files

    in Bass Projects

    Posted

    21 minutes ago, Ricci said:

    Hey Jay. 

    I really think it depends on your preferences, the environment and the content. What sounds good with rock or country outdoors might not sound so great with EDM in a small venue. I'd recommend to start with something relatively flat from 30-100Hz to start and flavor it to your preference over time. If you keep track of it well you may even end up with different presets depending on the musical style or the size of the venue / outdoors. 

    Thanks Josh, that makes good sense to me.  I guess in a way I have already experienced that through my own experiences.  For shows which are predominantly techno or psy I'm always adding a bump in the 80-110 or so range, which likely makes the response more similar to the cabinets raw sound.  On the other hand for more bass driven stuff I am pulling a bit of that bump out and adding a chunk around 30-60hz.  Gotta put some time in with more experimenting then, like you said it would nice to have a range of profiles to use to best suite the program material.

  3. Ricci's Skram Subwoofer & Files

    in Bass Projects

    Posted

    Some thoughts I've been having today about tuning.  It's almost pleasant enough up here in Canada to get into the backyard for some more measurements and tuning.  I have run my Skrams for a few shows now using a 120hz crossover and I haven't been able to fault it. These shows however have all been indoor so I am looking forward to more outdoor testing to get a better feel for what sounds best.   I want to build a hand full of presets using a range of crossover points so I can more easily switch between profiles for better A/B listening and testing.  Another thing that is on my mind is what would be the most preferable dsp corrected freq response shape for the Skrams.  The raw response out of the box has a gently rising shape to it, but up to this point I have been using some simply parametric eq to make the response basically flat.  I've been reading around trying to find info on this to see if there is a preferred shape to the response curve and I haven't found it talked about much.  It "seems" that a flat response is most common in the examples I have come across but I have also found some examples where the response is hottest in the low frequencies with it tailing off towards higher frequencies.  Here is an example from the 18sound website for one of their DIY cabinet designs for a dual 21" manifold type subs. First picture show the raw response, second picture shows their recommended corrected response.

    https://imgur.com/gallery/LYq4N8u

    https://imgur.com/gallery/kReqJkN

     

    What would determine a manufacturer,  or even a DIY cabinet builder to settle on a final response shape?  Is it purely based on what sounds best through lots of experimentation? Or is there something more specific at play. Any thoughts or feedback? What kind of corrected settings are you using for your Skrams?

    I would also be interested in what everyone is using for a hp on their skrams as well.  I've been using a 24db BW at 28hz on mine but for events where its all techno or psy I usually bump it up to 33-35hz as it tends to clean up the sound a bit where those low frequencies are not really needed as much

     

    • Like 1

  4. Ricci's Skram Subwoofer & Files

    in Bass Projects

    Posted

    I've got a pair of Sh-46 for pa work and a pair of Sm60f in my living room, both of which have been used with my Skrams. I love them more and more every time I get to hear them. The Sh-46 can effortlessly get extremely loud yet sound silky smooth at the same time. They are the best sounding pa speaker I have personally heard, and I get that feedback over and over again when I get them out for shows. Besides sounding awesome they also have unreal pattern control which is something I never considered being important until I owned them.  Consistent sound quality is a given with synergy horns, especially in indoor venues.  You can put the sound where you want it and keep it away from from walls and ceilings with ease.  I figure I would need 8 or more skram's to keep up with the pair of 46's.  The sm60f's on the other hand have more of a hifi sound to them. They are just magical in my living room and also pair up nicely with the Skrams.  The guy who I bought them from upgraded to the sh-50's and said the sm60f's sound every bit as good, but just don't go quite as low as them.   Some sh-50 are on my wishlist..... someday.  Pic added from last weekend

    https://imgur.com/gallery/UO0MrG7

    • Like 1

  5. Ricci's Skram Subwoofer & Files

    in Bass Projects

    Posted

     

    6 hours ago, peniku8 said:

    3 21DS115-8 in parallel per amp channel sounds like something I'd do. Their impedence minimum is pretty low and should be around 2 Ohm with 3 drivers in parallel.

    You could also get a point-symmetric setup that way. LCR. With a Skram beneath and on top of each main speaker if theres enough room. Put Skhorns in between for convenience.

    Yeah I am sort of kicking myself for going with the 4 ohm 21sw152's at this point. I am already running 2 4 ohms drivers off of each channel of my k10.  Ill have to add another amp soon to add more subs

     

  7. Ricci's Skram Subwoofer & Files

    in Bass Projects

    Posted

    21 hours ago, peniku8 said:

    It's just a different way of describing the same thing. Every 6db/octave is 1 order. 12db/oct is a 2nd order filter, 18db a 3rd order and so on.

     

    Well it's based on a bigger design I have not yet built, but I needed capable subs which could easily be handled by two people, so I went with a 320L cab which comes in at 63kg with casters. (The casters on the cab were a horrible idea, they resonate at 42Hz. I will build a caster board for future versions)

    The measurement was a quick 2m 2V groundplane (4 Ohm 21ds115) at 50°F/10°C outside in my backyard with no objects within 20m.
    The graphs shows the two required EQ points to EQ the response flat, but they should sound pretty neat inside a small to medium sized venue even without EQ. The two cascaded biquad HPQs form a BW4.

    When I've made up my mind whether to post the build thread on AVS or on here I'll do so. The thread will contain more in-depth views and info which I don't want to clutter the Skram thread with.
    I will however not release any plans for those. If you want some and live in the EU, shoot me a PM 😉

    7IoupRp.jpg

    TNP8NdJ.jpg

    Thanks Peniku8. that totally makes sense.  Thank for sharing with us your creation, looks amazing!  Ill keep my eye open if you ever decide to do a write up about, would love to hear more about it.

    Cheers

     

    peniku8

  8. Ricci's Skram Subwoofer & Files

    in Bass Projects

    Posted

    1 hour ago, peniku8 said:

    I have liked a 120Hz crossover setting when recently testing out my own bandpass-horn designs. Took 2 PEQ points to get the response within ±1db from 30-190Hz and the EV tops I used to test them with didn't have such a good mid/upper bass (impulse) response. If you're running the system flat and use a low shelf to shape the response to your liking, this crossover point works really well with these types of subs. Now if you like using the subs' volume control to shape your signal, I'd suggest running a lower crossover or just not doing so at all. I don't like hot subs crossed over any higher than 70Hz.

    You could also try crossover shapes with an even smoother knee. Cascade two BW2 and you'll get a LR4. Cascade 4 BW1 and you'll get what my Chinese amp lists as "Bessel", but it is not. Bessel is in between BW and LR, thus forms a +1.5db point at the crossover frequency in theory. Cascading 4 BW1 filters will result in a 4th order filter with considerable overshoot, so you could overlap the responses of subs and mains more and run subs hotter while maintaining a natural slope. You can experiment a lot with it, but I'd recommend doing so in a controlled environment outside with measuring gear. Once you get a response you like, it's easier to integrate that into a room instead of fighting both the room and the speakers at the same time imo.

    Thanks for your response peniku8. I'm not sure my dsp has the ability to set multiple filters like what you are suggesting but Ill dig it out when I get home tonight to take a look. I don't tend to mess with the volume control to shape my signal but sometimes Ill have an act playing on the system that seems to have a imbalanced signal compared to the other acts.  In those cases I will try to compensate with eq only.

    Could you tell us more about your bandpass horns? Having such a flat response from 30 all the way to 190 sounds really impressive!

  9. Ricci's Skram Subwoofer & Files

    in Bass Projects

    Posted

    2 hours ago, Revolt Sound said:

    I would highly recommend reading the attached white paper that was written by Paul Williams on crossover filters and there characteristics. Paul is responsible for the  DSP algorithms in Linea Research products. 

    CrossoverFilters White Paper -C.pdf 258.85 kB · 5 downloads

    Thanks Revolt sound, I hadn't come across this white paper before.  Not entirely sure I am understanding it all but it seemed to make a convincing argument for me to try playing around with LR filters instead of the BW filters.

    I do have something that I am not fully understanding.  How would you change a BW or LR filter between a 1st 2nd 3rd or 4th order filter?  When I look through my settings on my venu360 the options for crossovers just has the list of filters, BW LR etc with options for slopes, 12db 18db 24db etc but there is no settings for what order they are... am I missing something?

     

  10. Ricci's Skram Subwoofer & Files

    in Bass Projects

    Posted

    Hey guys.  I've been experimenting with crossover points between a single Skram and a single Danley Sh46 in my living room over the last couple of weeks.  I had never considered pushing the crossover point up higher than about 100hz but I am currently running a 125hz crossover point using BW24 filters and I can't fault the sound at all, in fact I think I am preferring it as sounds noticeably more dynamic and visceral.  I can't tell for sure if this would translate the same at war volumes due to my smallish living room but it has me thinking more about experimenting some more.  I am currently using the 24db BW filters as that is what is recommended in the Danley DSP recommendations but I'm wondering what the differences would be in trying some other settings.  I don't know enough about crossovers to really know how they are going to effect the sound other than trying to objectively listen to the differences.  Just curious if anyone has any input about this subject?  My initial thoughts around keeping the crossover lower around 100 or so is that the SH-46 can easily get down into 80hz with no problems but I think the Skrams will provide more energy in the 80 to 125 area.  What do you think would happen if I tried a different slope, something not as steep as a 24db, maybe something like a 12db or even less.  Would that allow more sharing of that bandwidth between the Skram and the Danley? Could that maybe improve or hurt the potential output?  I've gotten a pretty solid grasp on time and phase alignment so I am less afraid of allowing more sharing of certain frequencies between the two different cabs.... I am just not sure if this is a thing that people do, or if it is recommended at all.  I guess my thinking was that in scenarios where the 46's are placed further away from the subs the 46's would still have output down into the lower frequencies rather than being cut off sharper at 125hz from the 24db slope. Any thoughts?  

  14. Ricci's Skram Subwoofer & Files

    in Bass Projects

    Posted

    1 hour ago, klipsch said:

    Negative sir. It is an SH50. That is one of "the triplets" as my wife likes to call them. 😉 

    Ran the last sheet for the 2nd skram. A shot about halfway through...20200105_160624.thumb.jpg.9d30a9255e45223ed3e847619ec4400f.jpg

    You will have to give us your impressions of how the skram works with the Sh50.  I have used mine with both sh46 and sm60f's and I think they are a really great match with both.

  18. Ricci's Skram Subwoofer & Files

    in Bass Projects

    Posted

    I doubt it. Psytrance needs a lot of power and control in the kick and midbass range and the skrams deliver it without breaking a sweat.  Mind you the sh46’s pack a wallop themselves, matched up with the skrams its a potent combination.   I’ve been in front of enough f1 and turbosound systems that really excel at reproducing psytrance transients and my system doesn’t leave me wanting at all.  These Danleys continually blow me a away, I have no doubt Tom borrowed tech from recovered alien space craft 😂.  I have a stack of 6 reconditioned Martin Audio b115 front loaded horn kick bins as well, next summer I’ll give them a go between the Danleys and Skrams just to see what happens 

    • Like 2

  23. Ricci's Skram Subwoofer & Files

    in Bass Projects

    Posted

    26 minutes ago, Droogne said:

    Also sorry, to be someone else wondering about the CNC files, but I cant seem to figure out how to send this to my CNC operator in a way that he can effectively work with this. I downloaded the 3 files listed here above, but I cant seem to work out an 'easy' way to appoint the correct measurements, so my CNC guy can get to work. 

     

    Greetings

    From my understanding cnc machines often use slightly different software programs so there really isn't a one size fits all cnc file that will work with all machines.  Its likely the dxf files on the first post will require some tweaking by the operator anyways.  My cnc guy just converted the original pdf files to a format that works with his machine, added 50 bucks to labor price to do the conversion. 

     

    Prices on the DS and SW are stupid up here in Canada.  The best street price I have found for an SW was about 950 Canadian (about 720 US dollars).  Thankfully I have a buddy who works for PK Sound here in Calgary, I've been buying mine through them for about 550 US dollars shipped.  Only bummer is they have to come right from Italy so it has in the past taken between a month to two months to get here.

     

    On that note, I've started building another pair of cabinets so I can keep a pair in my livingroom at home.    I'm weighing the pro's and con's of staying with the 21sw152's that I've used in the previous 4 cabs vs saving a bit of money and trying a pair of the DS drivers instead.  It will be likely that occasionally Ill run all 6 together so maybe sticking with the same driver is my best move.... but it seems they do provide fairly similar performance.  What do you guys think? Should I just stick with the same drivers to match the others? A final consideration is ill be using a lesser quality amp to run the ones Ill keep in my house, a crest prolite 7.5 vs the k10 I use for my others.  Maybe the DS will work a bit better on the lesser amp?

  25. Ricci's Skram Subwoofer & Files

    in Bass Projects

    Posted

    Hey Josh, what would happen if you blocked a port internally where the port starts?  I personally don't need or feel the need to play with the tuning on mine but when I was constructing mine I thought to myself it might be easier to add the blockage internally where the vent port starts... It would also look nicer than doing it externally

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