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The Low Frequency Content Thread (films, games, music, etc)

Bass Movies Bass Movie Measurements Deep Bass Movies Bass Waterfall Graphs Bass Graphs

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#3841 maxmercy

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Posted 01 April 2017 - 12:46 AM

The first waterfall above probably went largely un-noticed, as there is little masking information higher in frequency and level.  Only those with terrific signal chains and capability will pick up on it, much like the transformation of Hugo Weaving into Red Skull in Captain America, or the final 'coin scene' in X-Men:First Class.

 

JSS



#3842 Kool-aid23

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Posted 01 April 2017 - 01:50 AM

Just want to shout out Max/Nube/Minnjd. As much as I like the graphs on another forum, the insight along with the graphs on this forum really help me understand what the quality of bass the movie studios are producing.

I hope you will continue to share.

#3843 MemX

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Posted 01 April 2017 - 02:27 PM

Lots of crazy graphs


Wuuuuuuut

I know that barely anyone will be able to reproduce those, but kudos for proper sound design!!

#3844 minnjd

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Posted 03 April 2017 - 01:14 PM

If I get time tomorrow evening I'll get Rogue One numbers up.



#3845 minnjd

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Posted 06 April 2017 - 04:51 AM

Rogue One: A Star Wars Story-Disney/Lucasfilm

 

DTS-HD MA 7.1

 

Supervising Sound Editors: Matthew Wood, Christopher Scarabosio

Sound Designers: Christopher Scarabosio, David Acord

Re-Recording Mixers: David Parker, Cristopher Scarabosio, Michael Semanick, Luke Dunn-Gielmuda, Tony Villafor

 

Level: 4 Stars (111.33dB composite)

Dynamics: 5 Stars (29.42dB)

Extension: 3 Stars (17Hz)- LAAAME

 

movie-324168.jpg

 

Ugh.  Lot of people had high hopes for this one (me included).  Well here it is.  It's got some loud bass, but a major 30Hz bump is pretty much guaranteed to overpower the at times decent ULF that is present.

 

And to no ones surprise there is clipping to be found, including some nasty flattops during the Jeddha destruction.  

 

movie-149352.jpg

 

The surrounds are spared but all three front channels and the LFE clip at -.5dBfs and clip heavily.  While this is better than The Force Awakens and its -3dBfs limiter it's still a damn shame.  I haven't had a chance to watch the film yet to see how bad the distortion is.

 

Coming in after Hacksaw Ridge this mix is even more disappointing.

 

I'll add my thought once I view the disc.

 

P.S.  As a side observation despite sharing almost the exact same sound crew as TFA, RO has a different mix philosophy regarding bass.  The main channels drop of sharply at 30Hz and are actually quite flat as far as bass activity.  The heavily peaked 30Hz material and pretty much all the ULF is contained in the LFE.
 


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#3846 SME

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Posted 06 April 2017 - 10:19 AM

Rogue One: A Star Wars Story-Disney/Lucasfilm

 

...

 

 

Plus: looks like BEQ has a high chance of success, and I even wonder if the track will sound a lot better with the hump flattened.  :)

 

Minus: Nasty looking clipping there.  But nasty looking isn't necessarily nasty sounding.

 

We'll have to listen to judge, and each may hear something different.  I've noticed that clipping is a lot less objectionable on my system now than in the past.  A big problem with clipping is that it tends to have cascading effects in the playback chain, making the sound progressively worse and nastier along the way.



#3847 maxmercy

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Posted 07 April 2017 - 12:25 AM

Here's what the preliminary BEQ looks like:

 

post-20-0-55142200-1491524716.png

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#3848 SME

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Posted 07 April 2017 - 07:10 AM

You left the 30 Hz hump intact?



#3849 maxmercy

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Posted 07 April 2017 - 11:07 AM

I broadened/flattened the hump as much as I could while still trying to add more Infrasonics, adding a touch more slam and trying to preserve the original overall PvA shape while keeping the signal from clipping.   

 

JSS


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#3850 maxmercy

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Posted 09 April 2017 - 12:49 AM

If you look at the BEQ by itself, the 'hump' doesn't look as bad:

 

post-20-0-10167900-1491698930.jpg

 

 

 

JSS

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#3851 minnjd

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Posted 09 April 2017 - 02:41 AM

I watched Rogue One tonight, so I can add subjective opinions to the numbers...

 

This is definitely a 30Hz humpfest, and most big low end effects have a distinctive 'tone' to them as a result.  It's so apparent that it becomes distracting at times.

 

For instance (and this is a spoiler if you're one of the holdouts that still haven't seen this one), when the Death Star destroys Jeddha City, there are a few big shots of the planet's surface lifting up and shattering due to the shock wave.  It's visually impressive.  Those shots also call for some incredibly deep, room shaking bass.  Now, the bass that is there is loud, and it does pressurize the room, but you can definitely feel that the lowest octave or so isn't quite there, and the 27-36Hz frequencies have been boosted so much that it almost sounds like a sine wave has been put into the effect.  It reminded me a bit of Interstellar in a way.

 

Whatever clipping is present is masked withing the louder effects, so for the most part it isn't noticeable (on my less than ideal system anyway).  Some explosions do have that 'crunch' to them that usually indicates that they are clipped, but it is brief and the soundtrack is well balanced in terms of volume spikes so at no point does it get fatiguing.

 

Overall this soundtrack is a bit of a disappointment.  The bass is much more one dimensional and generic than in The Force Awakens.  Even the brief Force rumbles are less interesting.  On it's own it might have been okay, but coming after Hacksaw Ridge it's a big letdown.


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#3852 SME

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Posted 09 April 2017 - 06:49 AM

I think I'd normally be inclined to watch a movie first without any BEQ, but with a review like this, maybe I should just skip straight to the BEQ for "Rogue One"?  At least it looks like there may be plenty of ULF content there, it just gets overwhelmed by the sound of the hump.



#3853 MikeDuke

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Posted 09 April 2017 - 03:27 PM

OK. This may be a stupid question and if it is, please feel free to let me know.  In addition to my sub, I have a crowson.  It goes down to 5hz i think.  It looks like this has low bass, juts not at a high level. I have it setup so it only gets frequencies below 35hz.  If that's the case, even though my sub may not get all of the low bass because of that huge spike, my chair should still feel a good portion of it shouldn't it?  Or am I totally wrong.



#3854 Infrasonic

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Posted 10 April 2017 - 05:27 PM

Yes. That is part of the reason for having the Crowson. It will extend the frequency response however... you will have to be sitting down to feel anything below 35hz on your system. ;)



#3855 MikeDuke

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Posted 10 April 2017 - 09:12 PM

Thanks.  I double checked and the lowest the crossover goes is 40hz.  Despite the graph, I am still looking forward to watching this.  If it is "like" Interstellar I will be fine with that.  Interstellar sounds fine on my setup and the Crowson does it's job well with that one.



#3856 maxmercy

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Posted 10 April 2017 - 11:32 PM

BEQ does well with this film.  Will post up on BEQ thread the solution.

 

JSS



#3857 MemX

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Posted 11 April 2017 - 12:03 PM

Thanks for your work, JSS!

#3858 MrEdge

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Posted 30 April 2017 - 08:32 PM

Hello, can maxmercy and minnjd give me their input on this. I've been messing around with SpecLab and i used the following settings. i ran a 20hz -10dB tone wav file to check my settings for accuracy but i noticed that my graph shows a different maximum db on the movie ''Fantastic Beasts and Where to Find Them'' compared to both of your graphs.

 

Note i put -20.2db on all channels except the LFE which is put at -10.2db

 

I uploaded my settings from SpecLab V2.92 b02

 

 

settings

g7k6Os4.png

 

84CNeLT.png

 

 

''Fantastic Beasts and Where to Find Them''

RiL6plz.png

 

 

 

20hz -10dB tone wav file

sEnvKzj.png

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#3859 maxmercy

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Posted 30 April 2017 - 10:05 PM

Your FFT setting are different, so your graphs do not pick up transient phenomena as well.  My FFT settings are:

 

Decimate : 48

 

FFT Length : 1024

 

Window: Nuttall

 

I do not use the anti-alias filter for decimation (box unchecked).

 

I use SpecLab v2.77 as it is the most user friendly for D-B uses.  

 

 

All FFT settings are a compromise.  Using longer windows gives you more freq resolution, but you lose some transient-sensing capability.  You can compensate with a longer window with a fixed gain value if you play with it, but I stay away from any offsets, and just use the numbers above, it's less complicated.  Offsets are how nube used to do it to get 0.5Hz resolution but to get the same amplitude on the PvA as the shorter window length FFT.    

 

JSS


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#3860 MrEdge

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Posted 30 April 2017 - 10:15 PM

Your FFT setting are different, so your graphs do not pick up transient phenomena as well.  My FFT settings are:

 

Decimate : 48

 

FFT Length : 1024

 

Window: Nuttall

 

I do not use the anti-alias filter for decimation (box unchecked).

 

I use SpecLab v2.77 as it is the most user friendly for D-B uses.  

 

 

All FFT settings are a compromise.  Using longer windows gives you more freq resolution, but you lose some transient-sensing capability.  You can compensate with a longer window with a fixed gain value if you play with it, but I stay away from any offsets, and just use the numbers above, it's less complicated.  Offsets are how nube used to do it to get 0.5Hz resolution but to get the same amplitude on the PvA as the shorter window length FFT.    

 

JSS

That is interesting i was looking for SpecLab v2.77 this morning and its no longer on the web. can you please send me a copy?. I've noticed that more updated version don't work well with the settings i downloaded here so i am now curious. thanks allot for the information i will be playing around in speclab a bit more.






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